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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Candice on SB 1012 Part Deaux...

Virginia angler hauls in a real catch - baltimoresun.com

License fees rejected

Coastal Conservation Association Maryland's rejection of a plan to raise fishing license fees to boost the anemic budget of the Department of Natural Resources isn't necessarily a bad thing - short term. As expected, the group's leadership, which helped draft the legislation to raise the fees in return for more say in fisheries management, ultimately decided the idea wasn't ready for prime time.

In a statement, CCA MD chairman Bill Curry called Senate Bill 1012 "well intentioned, but hastily conceived."

"While it contains provisions addressing our long-term goal of fisheries management reform and offers needed funding to support such management, it came at such a late date in the legislative session that we were unable to effectively engage our membership and the public on these far-reaching issues," he said.

Curry and others are concerned about chatter on Web sites such as Tidalfish.com, where anglers complained of being blindsided by the bill and wondered about the motives of its proponents.

As I said earlier this month, that's no way to make good law and build good relations for the long haul.

But it's time for the new DNR leadership to reach out to its customers, and it's time for CCA and other groups to strike while the iron is hot and everyone is talking about this issue.

Nothing would be worse for the Chesapeake Bay and those who enjoy it than to have this concept locked in the dark closet of "good ideas that require hard work."

Ken Lewis, CCA MD's legislative liaison, believes that recreational saltwater anglers will agree to pay more once they see "a real commitment to major change in fisheries management philosophy."

That's a good start. But when Lewis says "recreational saltwater anglers," I hope he means all of them. That includes Maryland's bass fishermen, who were sacrificed under SB 1012's proposed license fee increase, in the name of boosting tourism. The bass boys and girls would have been stuck paying the same fee as nonresidents for no additional benefits, which hardly seems fair.
 

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Belongs on the C&P Board
 

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Hey Chum

Thanks for the post. I caught it in the Sun, actually, thanks Candy:D

As for the whole thing about what can be posted and not, I had an exchange with the Executive Director of CCA MD this week about this stuff. He always gets upset when I move the discussions to the C&P board and his question is what is the difference between CCA posts and the stories that are posted of Candy, Angus and other writers. Since this seems like an appropriate thread to address this, I will say what I told Robert. The difference is that Candy, Angus and like writers are journalists, Robert or any other member of CCA that posts about "their" organization is doing so with a clear agenda. While one could make the argument that Candy, Angus and other like writers have an agenda, I would say that it might be the case, but they are still journalists and there is a difference between a journalist writing about a company and the company itself writing and publishing about itself. If you do not agree, I am open do a different point of view, but that is my stance.

In addition, this site is first and foremost about recreational fishing and enjoying the sport. Tidal Fish has no political agenda and was meant so everyone from all types of fishing could just enjoy talking about "fishing", learn from one another, could facilitate making new friends and having fun around the sport of fishing. Yes, politics, regulations and such are part of recreational fishing. Yes, we will not have any fishing if we do not do something about the declining fish populations and there is some room for the discussion and actions about it as long as it is done so in a balanced manner. From time to time this particular board becomes overrun with CCA MD posts and initiatives and I get feedback from people who are new to the site asking if this is a CCA board, meaning do all the people share in the opinion and does Tidal Fish endorse CCA. The answer is that Tidal Fish of course supports conservation, but it is not it's sole purpose for existence, but a part of it. Tidal Fish supports all the recreational fishing groups, but does not "endorse" any one in particular.

I do publish all the news and press releases that I receive from CCA, MSSA and other groups and agencies etc under our news section on the homepage of Tidal Fish. I track how many reads they receive and I will tell you it reaches into the thousands, so they do get traffic. I offered to do this for CCA MD. In addition, I am working with the CCA VA, because they approached me with a proposal, where they could get their announcements at the top of the board in the sticky announcement offering we have. We are working out the details, but I will say that I greatly appreciate CCA VA approaching me the way they did instead of encroaching on boards as I have asked people not to do in the past. I am confident that we will do a win-win deal with CCA VA in the coming weeks. We also have been talking with some other groups who approached us as well, and I am sure we will come to a deal with them.

Well, that is the story folks. I hope people are actually not reading this post this morning and are out fishing;-) :D

Brandon
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
What is interesting though Brandon is that the "journalists" are finding and reporting "news" that, according to this article at least, is being made on your website. Chances are this "News" wouldn't have been reported if it had been shuttled off to the Conservation Board immediately because without the massive numbers available on the main board it wouldn't have been news at all...Capice?

This is the Town Hall, bro...

Tidalfish.com just got placed in front of how many Baltimore Sun readers? Think about that impressions per minute count, or whatever...
 

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Chum

I greatly appreciate the press and I know Candy knows that because I always drop her a note to say thanks.

Having said that, I am not going to compromise on my above statements in the name of "press". I think your viewpoint is that I should leave this sorts of posts because it leads to press like this. Yes, it does. But I will not allow it just because it leads to getting press. We can get press a lot of other ways too, like from having a great fishing report by someone and that being picked up as happens on a good number of occasions, or having a member of the community mentioned for something and it being talked about and picked up because of Tidal Fish (ie Capt Skip's recent article or Wish a Fish or something along those lines).

I am not saying that conservation and policy talk does not have a place here, it does, but it is not everything Tidal Fish is about nor will it become that. It is important and discussion is needed, it just needs to be balanced, and not overdone because like I said, it is not everything that Tidal Fish is about.

Brandon

PS the $55 stuff is really old. I think you can drop it now.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
Balanced, absolutely...The Chessy Board doesn't need 14,000 SB 1012 threads...Maybe if and when they do get moved in the future, one representitive thread could get left on the main board for further discussion, with a jump (much like the print media) to the Conservation Board for the others that have been moved...Thereby preserving the integrity of the main board while also allowing those who may not have been exposed to those issues in the past an opportunity to peruse the issues of the day concerning the future of their fishery...

Oh, and yes, the exposure is certainly nice for Tidalfish.com, but pay close attention to what that article says. TF is making news. The open forum of the Chessy Board and the nature of the internet allowed for timely discussion of SB 1012 that in the old days simply wouldn't have been possible. You influenced public policy through this board. That's pretty big bud, bigger than GrayMug's latest shattered St. Croix...(Although we all dearly love hearing about Graymug's latest shattered St. Croix)
 

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As for the whole thing about what can be posted and not, I had an exchange with the Executive Director of CCA MD this week about this stuff. He always gets upset when I move the discussions to the C&P board and his question is what is the difference between CCA posts and the stories that are posted of Candy, Angus and other writers.
Brandon, I thought we were having a private conversation and I'm going to keep it that way except to say I don't agree with your characterization of our exchange this week. If I was upset, you would've heard from me. I was no more upset than when a reporter or columnist doesn't use a press release for an article or column.

You moved a thread of mine, as far as I was concerned, it was over, case closed. I had no intention of registering a complaint, and I never have in the past either. It's your sight. You b-mailed me, not the other way around, and I replied that some consistency would be nice.

The offer still stands, waiting for a private reply.
 

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Chum

I have given some thought to your comments and suggestions over the last few days believe it or not;-)

I think you may have a point in allowing a high profile conservation issue to be discussed and/or debated while designating one thread only to have that happen. I am not sure how to quite designate that "one thread" yet and open to ideas. However, I do think it is a good suggestion and would eliminate some of the issues and problems I have with conservation posts over running the message board.

It would be one thread, if someone wants to read it is only one thread, if they do not then they do not have to click on it. The rules for debate are simple and unchanged, if you insult or attack anyone you are booted.

The last remaining issue is figuring out how to designate that "one thread per high profile issue". Suggestions can be sent via Private message or email to me.

Thanks Chum.

Brandon
 

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Sorry I'm late

Hey gang:
Just got back from Tokyo and saw the thread.
I think the Chumster raises a good point, one that newsrooms around the country are wrestling with.
There is no doubt that TF makes news. It's one reason--just one--that I subscribe to and look in on it 6 or 10 times a day.
(Actually, I keep trying to visualize Mr. Chum and channel his karma)
The turnout last year to defeat the yellow perch plan was, no no small part, generated by discussion here. The same goes for circle hook discussions, C&R regs, etc.
DNR people read what's written here as do some politicians.
TF is no less a window into a particular group than any Washington-based political Web site. For some reason, political boards have a cache that boards devoted to recreational pursuits so not enjoy.
I don't mention TF in my column just to score brownie points. Lord knows, when I first started writing this column seven years ago, I cringed to come on and read the critiques of my work. NOTHING will keep you more humble than that.
But I have found that the board is an early indicator of satisfaction or dissatisfaction with policy or conditions.
There are 800,000 anglers in Maryland, ranging from part time to fanatical, according to US Fish and Wildlife Service and the US Census. And you're spread from Deep Creek lake to Assateague.
Since we can't afford to poll y'all every month, this is one of the few ways I know to get the pulse of the community.
For that, I am grateful.
Candy
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Hey gang:
Just got back from Tokyo and saw the thread.
I think the Chumster raises a good point, one that newsrooms around the country are wrestling with.
There is no doubt that TF makes news. It's one reason--just one--that I subscribe to and look in on it 6 or 10 times a day.
(Actually, I keep trying to visualize Mr. Chum and channel his karma)
The turnout last year to defeat the yellow perch plan was, no no small part, generated by discussion here. The same goes for circle hook discussions, C&R regs, etc.DNR people read what's written here as do some politicians.
TF is no less a window into a particular group than any Washington-based political Web site. For some reason, political boards have a cache that boards devoted to recreational pursuits so not enjoy.
I don't mention TF in my column just to score brownie points. Lord knows, when I first started writing this column seven years ago, I cringed to come on and read the critiques of my work. NOTHING will keep you more humble than that.
But I have found that the board is an early indicator of satisfaction or dissatisfaction with policy or conditions.
There are 800,000 anglers in Maryland, ranging from part time to fanatical, according to US Fish and Wildlife Service and the US Census. And you're spread from Deep Creek lake to Assateague.
Since we can't afford to poll y'all every month, this is one of the few ways I know to get the pulse of the community.
For that, I am grateful.
Candy
That is absolutely true...The people on that bus to Cambridge came almost exclusively from the TF community and that is precisely why some people don't want word one on the main board about rec fishing issues. They know the power of the Chessie Board and they will work to get those threads moved.

As far as what thread to keep as a representitive thread on the main board? I dunno...Keep it simple, play editor, pick the one with the most concise headline that captures the issue...Hell, I've known editors, I were an editor, it's so easy a caveman could do it...
 

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Excellent thread that speaks to the "new world order."

Recreational fishing has changed dramatically in the past 10-15 years with advent of the affordable personal computer. Is it good or bad ? Perhaps a lot of both...
 

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Not to create a rouse, but as Candy stated, there are 800,000 anglers in MD. Still don't think they make an impact on the Bay? And not just on the econimc side of things. I would just ask that in the foray of politico and journalism that things are presented fairly and balanced.

Chum, believe it or not I'm not just a commercial waterman, but I also love the recreational side and spending time with my family fishing and crabbing especially now that I have a grandson. So I have a vested interest in the Bay's health not just for the commercial aspects.

Brandon, I will say that exposure on the Chesapeake board is warrented at times, but I am trying to do my best by raising interests on the Conservation Board. If as Chum says we all know that no one reads the Conservation board, then how many are legitimately interested in the Bay's health.

Brian

P.S. Brandon, I think you are doing a Bang Up Job!
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
The POINT is that many people wouldn't even know there's a problem with the Bay unless it is brought to their attention and it won't be brought to their attention unless it is on this Board...

They may have some vague notion that something is wrong with the Bay and not have a clue what to do about it or how to get involved.

They won't go looking for something they don't even know exists...

Do I look like a friggen conservationist? Do I just scream Greenpeace? Noooooooo...I used to kill small mammels for fun and eat them. I give granola heads nervous twitches, and if this board could wake me up as to things we can do to improve the situation with the Bay, nobody is out of reach...
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
The neverending saga of SB 1012 continues...

1012 cleared committee yesterday, and Candy? Guess what? Funny how those funding bills grow legs of their own...What was a bad bill just became more comical, the matching fund requirement was effectively stripped out, but MSSA got two seats on the oversight taskforce...The irony in that last statement is enough to make me laugh out loud...

So essentially rec anglers are getting their liscence fees jacked without even a meaningless promise of matching funds...Oversight...

God give me strength...

I need some Hendrix stat...
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
But Chris, it sunsets if we're still not happy in a few years.
Oh yeah, I forgot about that Robert, and if I put a tooth under my pillow the Tooth Fairy will show up in the middle of the night in a leather teddy and give me a full body massage, right?

How many times have I said it? Don't piss on me and tell me it's raining...This bill has officially gone from being a poorly drafted bill to a friggen joke played on rec anglers...

I hope nobody cries too loud when the money gets diverted to play put and take oyster welfare for the MWA recipients...Hey, the MSSA wanted it, and they got BWHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA two seats on the heh, heh, OVERSIGHT TASKFORCE...

Beautiful...
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Can you say "Piggy Back Tax". It was only suppose to last a few years. It was never meant to be a PERMANENT tax. :nono:
Let me say this in a way that cannot be misunderstood...You are stoned if you think this will sunset.

This is money...

This is a state with a 1.4 billion dollar projected budget deficit...

This money will be used as DNR, or the General Assembly sees fit...

The MSSA couldn't oversee anything and there is no task that doesn't confuse them, Rich Novotny can't figure out whether he is in favor of undersized crabs for commercial harvest or not for cryingoutloud...

In three years the DNR will come back and say they have created staff positions with this money, although there will be no way to prove that, and that they will have to reduce their staff if this money vaporizes...

You with me so far?

Even the pretense of matching funds is gone...You just signed off on a bill promoted by a DNR consultant, to pay an agency that pays him to send out angler surveys so late they are useless, that thinks a put and take oyster program/industry is "Oyster Restoration" when anyplace reasonable would consider it welfare, and after eight years of meetings and restocking efforts thinks the right thing to do to bring yellow perch back is to open more rivers to commercial netting!

It would take a smart team of miscreants and ner-do-wells months to come up with a legislative scenario remotely stupider than this...

If dumb was dynamite you wouldn't want to smoke around here...
 
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