Tidal Fish Forum banner
1 - 19 of 19 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,399 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
---Omega , dropped to 3.92 Today --Hope that we may get a NORMAL ole time SPRING, Migration of Mature Alewies --a First class Wire line Thumping Mature Alewies , As Far as the Eye Can see on top during a Slack --24#Blues , 16# grey trout , & Dormat Flounder , taking 11/0 CC with 6 Oz. of lead , 250 back --Hooked Rockfish runs that Empty a fully spooled 6/0 senator to the backing --Backing Down to gain line back , while the fleet Gathers for a look see ---I Wish No one aFailed Businness, Least a Famine in Reedsville , But Just a Break in the Months of the "Going Home to Spawn" migration ---To the Nursery Provider , The Great State Of Maryland --The Bank for Juniville Fish , that never gets paid one pennies Intrest , W/o a Bended knee--I flounder per --1 rock per trip a day for Rec. Anglers--1 rock per day for charters ---Pound & Gill Netters & H&L 36" limit year around ---While 120 miles away Eggs are forming NOW in our MOMMIE FISH ---To be Slaughtered --I understand that Fishery will be Watched Closely by Newport News C G & more acurate catch figures will be Collected ---No female Crab fishery , & the crabbers need work --Hell Deputize em --they Know how it works in the Enforcement Game--Gotta Go the Admiral says Come in & EAT --geo.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,399 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Could you explain how a lower stock price will keep them from fishing? I would think they would want to show a better quarterly and catch the [email protected]## out of them.
--3 mo. ago there were at 16.00--There IS A CAP on the #'s Harvested --
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,006 Posts
--3 mo. ago there were at 16.00--There IS A CAP on the #'s Harvested --
C.G,That "Cap" don't mean ****.IF I remember correctly,There is a Cap as you say....BUT if they don't meet that Cap,they can Take the #'s they did'nt catch and add it to the next years "Cap".Correct me if I'm wrong.[Mike]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,819 Posts
I would guess the percentage is about the same as landscaping, and now construction.Although now with the economy going south some of the illegals may be doing the same.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,563 Posts
What I'm about to say will make me as popular on here as a stomach virus, but I'm starting to back off of my earlier willingness to blame Omega for the lack of Menhaden in the Bay earlier this decade.

Last year, and to a greater degree this year, we are seeing a lot of Menhaden -- including large ones -- from spring through fall. I obviously cannot produce scientifically vetted numbers, but anecdotal evidence supports the notion that we are at least approaching what I recall seeing in the mid-80s.

Maybe in the mid-70s it was even better and same with the mid-60s, so my benchmark may be set pretty low, but I am willing to bet some money that we now have far more Menhaden, large and small, then we had from 2001-2006. Has Omega reduced its operations during the past two years? Has it increased the mesh size of its nets? Has it concentrated more in the Atlantic and less in the Bay?

I'm as alarmed by industrial catch of wild seafood as anyone, but focusing just on the specific problem of localized Chesapeake Menhaden depletion, the last two years seem to provide evidence that Omega may not be the primary culprit of past depletions.

I suppose a cynic might suspect that all of this coincides too neatly with Omega coming under the conservation microscope and being subjected to localized depletion studies. Under this theory, Omega is fishing less in the Bay during the study period in the hope that the study results will allow it to lift the cap and go back to business as usual in the Bay. However, until we have evidence of that, and until we understand why we have more Menhaden in the Bay now, then it may be a bit premature to point to Omega as the primary factor in Chesapeake Menhaden population fluctuations.

Another issue to consider is the importance of those little Omega3 tablets. Maybe someone from the medical profession can chime in, but the more I learn about it, the more it strikes me as pretty important to the health of a lot of folks. I know that other, non-fish-derived Omega3 sources exist, but I have read that they are not true substitutes for the fish-oil Omega3. Again, a cynic could say that this is all a result of creative advertising and paid-for "studies" by Omega and its industry partners. Unless that can proven, however, or unless other credible sources conclude that non-fish Omega3 is just as good, then we have a real problem (from a business, political and even moral standpoint) to overcome if the objective is to shut down or even reduce Omega's operations.
 

·
Tidal Fish Subscriber - I Support TidalFish.com!
Joined
·
7,173 Posts
Jeff - There are numerous alternatives to Omega Protein products for obtaining fish-oil supplements. The issue at stake is not whether Omega supplements are good for you but rather the impact that this particular fishery, strategically located at the mouth of the Bay, has on the health of the Bay. When companies locate in areas that have such a hugely negative impact on a major ecosystem such as the Chesapeake Bay, we need to rethink whether that company's existence is more important than an entire ecosystem. I think not. We spend considerable time discussing oysters which are invaluable but don't fully appreciate the value of menhaden as even more effective filter-feeders. If we had far healthier oyster and menhaden populations that were not decimated by fishing, we would have a far healthier, thriving Bay. Jim

Please open this link and scan down to Omega Protein... Fish Oil Supplements - Seafood Selector - Environmental Defense Fund

How Safe Are Fish Oil Supplements? - Seafood Selector - Environmental Defense Fund

The omega-3s found in fish (EPA and DHA) appear to provide the greatest health benefits. Fish that are high in omega-3s, low in environmental contaminants and eco-friendly include:

wild salmon from Alaska (fresh, frozen and canned),
Arctic char,
Atlantic mackerel,
sardines,
sablefish,
anchovies
farmed oysters
farmed rainbow trout and
albacore tuna from the U.S. and Canada.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,563 Posts
Good info. Thanks. I've skimmed it and am left with one big question; given that EDF also takes the position that Omega3 from fish is better than Omega3 from other sources, is it confident that the "good" fish species that it lists can supply, at a sustainable harvest rate, the anticipated future demand for Omega3? Of course, the same can be said for the sustainability of Atlantic/Gulf Menhaden.

I'll take a closer read through your links over the weekend. Thanks again.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,295 Posts
What I'm about to say will make me as popular on here as a stomach virus, but I'm starting to back off of my earlier willingness to blame Omega for the lack of Menhaden in the Bay earlier this decade.

Last year, and to a greater degree this year, we are seeing a lot of Menhaden -- including large ones -- from spring through fall. I obviously cannot produce scientifically vetted numbers, but anecdotal evidence supports the notion that we are at least approaching what I recall seeing in the mid-80s.

Maybe in the mid-70s it was even better and same with the mid-60s, so my benchmark may be set pretty low, but I am willing to bet some money that we now have far more Menhaden, large and small, then we had from 2001-2006. Has Omega reduced its operations during the past two years? Has it increased the mesh size of its nets? Has it concentrated more in the Atlantic and less in the Bay?

I'm as alarmed by industrial catch of wild seafood as anyone, but focusing just on the specific problem of localized Chesapeake Menhaden depletion, the last two years seem to provide evidence that Omega may not be the primary culprit of past depletions.

I suppose a cynic might suspect that all of this coincides too neatly with Omega coming under the conservation microscope and being subjected to localized depletion studies. Under this theory, Omega is fishing less in the Bay during the study period in the hope that the study results will allow it to lift the cap and go back to business as usual in the Bay. However, until we have evidence of that, and until we understand why we have more Menhaden in the Bay now, then it may be a bit premature to point to Omega as the primary factor in Chesapeake Menhaden population fluctuations.

Another issue to consider is the importance of those little Omega3 tablets. Maybe someone from the medical profession can chime in, but the more I learn about it, the more it strikes me as pretty important to the health of a lot of folks. I know that other, non-fish-derived Omega3 sources exist, but I have read that they are not true substitutes for the fish-oil Omega3. Again, a cynic could say that this is all a result of creative advertising and paid-for "studies" by Omega and its industry partners. Unless that can proven, however, or unless other credible sources conclude that non-fish Omega3 is just as good, then we have a real problem (from a business, political and even moral standpoint) to overcome if the objective is to shut down or even reduce Omega's operations.
Jeff, I beleive you're correct in your assessment that there seems to a better abundance of bait in the bay this year. I have made the same observation and I believe we've had pretty decent fishing. What impact any change Omega may or may not made in their operation that contributed to this would be speculation at best. Having said that I've fished the bay my entire life recreationally, I'm 62 now. The amount of bait Capt George is referring to, was measured by acres not feet or yards. I also remember the days of slammer Blues, doormat Flounder, 15 lbs. Trout but those days also included a 12" minimum size on Rockfish with no limit and we saw what that got us, a moratorium!! Maybe shutting down Omega would not return the acres of baitfish of years past to the bay but it sure would be interesting to see what it would be like if Omega shut down it's entire operation for just one year.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
26,232 Posts
Yes there is some baitfish this year but nothing compared to the 80's.I can remember schools of bait miles long by 300 feet wide.Every river in evening was covered bank to bank with surface feeding Menhadden.

Offshore we would see acres of 12-16 inchers.

Now we all get excited over a few schools the size of a house.No where near how it used to be.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,478 Posts
Menhaden & Chesapeake Bay

As the result of striper fishing for 15 years I am convinced that because Omega takes almost all of their fish from the Chesapeake Bay, it has hurt the bay.

IE 10-15 years ago when we cut open the stomachs of stripers they were full of Menhaden and maybe 1 trout. For the last several years they are full of trout and maybe one or two small Menhaden. Now grey trout in the lower bay are very hard to find. That is quiet a strong indication of what is going on in the lower bay. me.

In addition there are numerous studies out there that say there are not enough mature Menhaden in the bay to support their reproduction.

http://www.savethefish.org/PDF_files/SWS_1203_for_web.pdf

Dick Russell - Articles

Group Calls for Menhaden Conservation

I would also suggest that you consider reading the book "The Most Important Fish in the Sea" by Bruce Franklin. Even though it is mostly one side of the argument, the historical information is too much to ignore.

Omega should be allowed to continue to fish for Menhaden, but not to annually take up to 105,000 metric tons of Menhaden from such a fragile eco system as the Chesapeake Bay. They need to spend more time fishing for Menhaden in the EEZ where there are more Menhaden and there will be less of an impact on one of the most productive ecosystems on the east coast.

Kevin Smith
Weekend Mistress
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,580 Posts
Anyone seen Whale Wars on Animal Planet? Maybe we should get those Sea Shepard people into the bay to harass the Omega boats.
 

·
Tidal Fish Subscriber - I Support TidalFish.com!
Joined
·
7,173 Posts
Anyone seen Whale Wars on Animal Planet? Maybe we should get those Sea Shepard people into the bay to harass the Omega boats.
I would contribute
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
26,232 Posts
Most convincing agruement to ban Omega is that almost all the other Altantic states did. Only NC and Va allow Omega to net.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,399 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
---Regardless, of the needs of omega 3 oil --As far as I see it it is a Bi -Product of the Fish Meal needed for Agricultureial Feeds --Fish meal is the Primary staple in the Chicken Industry & very important as alot of Corn has been funneld off for Ethonol --I too agree the"peanut Bunker' crop has Improved , but they too have Matured here in Md. & really have little food value in the Spring Migration because of thier Size --My thoughts have always been Fish ( All Species) have been stopping short where they feel Confortable based on the Food Abundence Found--Lack of bait has always been an issue in the upper & mid Bay in the last 15 years , I know some Dissagree , but I Blame some of our Blue Crab Problems, on the fish that prey on them instead of Bait Fish --Hope it will keep getting Better --This & Fishing Too -geo.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,029 Posts
Today's baitfish are a drop in the bucket compared to the 70s when I came of age (Skip was not exaggerating)...and the blues were voracious but couldn't put a dent in the baitfish population.

Yes, omega3 is a great pill...but other sources of fish pills are better than what the bay pirates provide: nordicnaturals.com. They harvest in an ecologically sound way and provide a better pill.

Tell the farmers to use chicken byproducts for their feed. There is no rational reason for industrial fishing in an estuary so important to the entire east coast fishery/environment. Ban the harvest of all filter feeders in the Bay (and ban sharking to get the cownose pop back to a natural level- oysters would have a chance and your crabs will come back too). It's all connected.

I'm sure Omega is smart enough to fudge the studies somehow...what do they have to lose?
 
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
Top