[Getaway]

The title should read SR1087.

I emailed the Senator in ref. to my opposition to his bill. This is his response;


Mr. Martin:
Thank you for your e-mail regarding my legislation to increase the size of
the Virginia Marine Resources Commission.

I'm sorry you do not support this bill. As passed by the Senate, the
compromise legislation adds two additional working watermen to the
commission, bringing the total of commercial watermen to three on the now
10 member board. It also recommends that when appointments come up, an
effort is made to include representation of diverse fishing interests.

The Virginia Marine Resource Commission has taken dramatic steps to try and
revive the crab population of the Chesapeake Bay. They have reduced the
catch of crabbers by 34 percent and they have limited the season – saying
that no crabs could be taken in late October and November.

I think when we are taking actions that dramatically alter a person’s
ability to make a living, they ought to have a seat at the table. They may
not prevail, but they should be able to argue their case.

I hope you will continue to share your concerns with me.

Senator John Miller

 

[tonydivefish]

" arguing their case " and having a upper hand in the vote are two totally diff. things.

 

[Getaway]

I sense a hand-in-the-pocket book, head-the-sand approach on someone's part.

 

[Mike Avery]

Seems evident to me that our legislators do not fully understand that VMRC's mission is both commerical and recreational. I think they see the VMRC as soley there to support the commerical fisherman only. I would be willing to bet the legislators are clueless on how recreational regulations are established and that it's the same group of VMRC officials that do both.

 

[Tom Powers]

There was a 3 1/2 hour public hearing just before the vote where they implemented that 34% reduction. The public comment section did not end until NO ONE else wanted to speak. No time limits were placed on the individuals who chose to speak. I would say that they had all the opportunity to argue their case.

 

[Kevin Smith]

What???

He is not mentioning they already have one seat on the commission (at the table) and had their chances to speak on this issue on multiple occaisions

IE- The VMRC started engaging all of the appropriate parties in how to reduce the harvest of the blue crab and had at least three Commission meetings where all stakeholders had a chance to express their opinions. In April after a 3 1/2 hour public hearing, VMRC passed the regulations to manage the blue crab fishery for 2008 and to reduce the catch of female crabs by 34% as directed.

Where did they not have a chance to be part of this process? Is John Miller suggesting the closing of the winter crab dredging was a mistake?

Kevin
Weekend Mistress

 

[Bob Allen]

Finally got an e-mail from Senator Miller:

Dr. Allen:
I receive several hundred e-mails a day and I personally answer every one
that comes from a constituent. I'm sorry you have had to wait a few days
for my response.

Obviously, I disagree with your assessment of the situation. I have a hard
time believing that people who depend on the Bay for their livelihood
would take steps to endanger their own economic well-being.


Senator John Miller


My comment to readers on Tidalfish: Senator: “you better believe it !!”

RBA


MY REPLY TO THIS LETTER:

Senator Miller:

You have been snookered by commercial crabbers. Most conservation minded folks in your district have been working for 15 or more years on reducing the commercial (self destructive) influence on the VMRC Now our Savior of the Chesapeake Bay, Senator John Miller , arrives and without consultation to those who GENUINELY have been attending VMRC meetings, those who have voluntarily served on committees , paying no attention to constituents with years of experience in working on protecting the Chesapeake Bay: John Miller and the Daily Press highlight your efforts to restore the Bay....what you are looking out for is for the crabber , who has never looked out for the resource, but bucked year after year , requests to help control the burgeoning commercial harvests of Blue Crabs inside Chesapeake Bay.

The Blue Crab industry , like the oyster industry before it, is already destroyed , by those same crabbers that tricked you into such a naive bill.

There are few crabs left, there is no place to process them if they are harvested again, there are no crab pickers, they have moved on.

Can we expect new exciting legislation to re-open the Crab processing houses that used to surround Sunset Creek? Will Hampton , down town, once again smell of cooking crabs and be refereed to as " crab-town" ? Can we look forward to legislation that will bring undocumented Mexican workers to pick crabs? . Will you call for legislation to tear down the 10 story luxury hotel on the Hampton waterfront to get us back to the four story stack of oyster shells that were so picturesque? Will the State move the Air and Space museum and the Carousel back to Langley Field and to Buckreo Beach respectively? How far back do you intend to legislate?

You are to be complimented for being concerned about the economic the well-being of the Crabbers...;but you are definitely not, as the Daily Press attempted to paint you, a conservationist interested in improving the Chesapeake Bay.

Dr. Bob Allen
1038 Port Harb our Arch
Hampotn Va 23664

757-869 0157

 

[baitbox]

Obtuse on purpose

If you let the fox guard the henhouse he will eventually eat all the chickens. Why don't you send him the article on the watermen in Maryland and Virginia that who vigorously protected the striped bass fishery in the Potomoc. When he is up for reelection, make sure to repost his support for the commercial guys at the expense of the recreationals so we can include that in our decision who to vote for.

 

[bullisland]

Have any of you guys ever worked the water?

You guys are sadly mistaken if any of you think that three watermen on the VMRC board wil make any difference. That still leaves 70% recreational fishermen on the board. You guys are out there for fun just like I am. i enjoy catching fish as mush as the next guy. But seriously, if you think that 2 more watermen on that board will hurt your fishing you are crazy. just like i said in an earlier post, over $10 million per year is put into VA's economy whereas commercial fisheries might generate $2 million. VMRC and VA's General assembly knows this. You guys honestly think that they would do anything to lose money. Get Real. I grew up with my father working the water, and I can personally vouch for the stupid @$$ laws that watermen have to deal with. One such law, Anyfish that is caught in a gill net out of a particular season(dead or not) are to be thrown back. If they are not yet dead I understand and itould be hard to govern that law. But most wtermen are honest people made to be dishonest just to support their family. I have tried to get people to see both sides of the coin but it is quite obvious that most poeple havea bad case of tunnel vision. Recreational and commercial fishermen both.

 

[Bob Allen]

Senator Miller voting strength is primarily in Newport News and Hampton. There are not very many active commercial crabbers in his district. So one wonders how the commerical crabbing interests got him to introduce and support his naive SB 1087? He probably is genuinely concerned about the economic welfare of the crabber....but aren't we all? HE is in office for six years now. but this has been such stinging legislation, that I think John Miller will have to do a lot of "fence mending" by next election. Most of Miller's constituents and supporters are Democratic, conservation minded folks, that will be reminded of his legislative inexperience in attempting to rip the present VMRC.

This winter has been the first time in a century that Virginia watermen have not dredged crabs from the bottom of the Bay. The end of winter dredging (March 15) is expected to result in millions of more females emerging from muddy hibernation to spawn this spring and summer.
All the rules combined with fragile stocks led the federal government last year to declare the Bay's crab fishery a national disaster - the first time such a finding has been made in Virginia.
Congress approved $20 million in disaster relief to suffering watermen, with Virginia and Maryland splitting the amount.

THE ECONOMIC HARDSHIPS OF CRABBERS IS BEING RECOGNIZED AND HELP IS BEING GIVEN...!! $10 Million for VA Crabbers !!

Bob Allen, Hampton Va

 

[Tom Powers]

Bullisland.

I beg to differ. Currently three of the Commissioners have direct financial interest in the commercial fishing industry. Ernie Bowden is a full time commercial fisherman (as per state code). Klye Shick is a part time commercial fisherman who also operates a marina. Rick Robbins owns Bernie's Conchs and manages Chesapeake Bay Packing. Adding two more commercial fishermen to the Commission would give half of the 10 seats (is currently 8) to individuals with interests in the commercial fishing industry.

 

[Bob Allen]

Senator Miller must be feeling some heat from his constituents... He sent me two more e-mails this morning...I sent him three ....

At least he recognizes that folks in his district are not happy with his bill SB 1087. He probably is hearing from the House that there is a lot of phone and e-mail traffic opposing the bill there.

Keep up the pressure...

Telephone a few legislators on the House AG and Tribs committee this afternoon....call the Governor Kaine and ask him to give some cover to Delgates that want to kill this bill. Write Secty of Natural Resources Preston Bryant and tell him to step up to the plate and defend his VMRC.

Bob Allen

 

[hookinfinger]

I am not familiar with Senator Miller. I will say this though, I am pretty impressed with the way he is responding. I am not in agreement with him but the fact that he takes time to respond at all is pretty refreshing.

I have written to several politicians in the past and of the few that have responded all I received from them was a canned response.




Dennis)

 

[Bob Allen]

Senator Miller is a freshman Democrat...never been in politics before. He is from the Peninsula and even though VMRC headquaters is here, I doubt he even knows where they are located. He probably has never attended a meeting, of any sort there. I suggest he has no idea who each present commissioner represents and the work that has gone on there for the 100years...much less recent dutes expected of VMRC staff and Commissioners.

He did not answer the first 3 e-mail that I sent....and I reminded him that I voted for him the last election. Senator Miller sent back canned letters to his constituents...they were all the same...blah...blah blah!!! I saw them..


That all changed when I attacked the Daily Press editorial this week painting him as a benevolent protector of the resources of Ches Bay???

He sent me two replies to my recent e-mails and they were not "canned" ; it is obvious that he is getting some heat.

He hs changed his tune.

Keep up the pressure...Telephone Governor Kaine, Secty of Natural REsources Preston Bryant asking them to work behind the scenes to stop Senator Miller' bill 1087. Contact any House member you know...your own representative will appreciate your attention. let him/her know that this Miller bill sb 1087 setting marine management back 30 years, should be opposed.

Bob Allen Hampton, VA

 

[hookinfinger]

I guess I spoke to soon Dr. Allen. I should have known there was something more to it.


Well I am not disappointed because my opinion that most politicians don't give a chit about what we think is still in tack.



Dennis)

 

[Kevin Smith]

Senator John Miller's Reponse is a Form Letter

Dennis,

I have seen 2 or 3 letters from John Miller in response and they say exactly the same thing word for word.

We should not be very impressed with him because he has a bill that will potentially reverse a very positive change to help Chesapeake Bay Blue Crabs recently made by the VMRC. In addition he cares so much about the Chesapeake Bay Fisheries and Marine Resoucres that he defends his actions and bill in a form letter to people that ask him to change his mind. Sad-Just plain sad!

Kevin
Weekend Mistress

 

[GATORMAN]

I always find it interesting when folks claim that "Federal or State regulations" put them out of business. That was successfully argued up north when draggers pretty much destroyed the George's Banks Fishery - one of the most productive fisheries in the world (see the article quote below). The Fed bought a bunch of fishing boats & commercial licenses from fishermen, along with some kind of guarantee from those fishermen. I don't have details on the guarantee, but I'm sure they would only be restricted from getting another boat for the same kind of fishing for a period of time. Because of the conflict of interest of National Marine Fisheries Service (i.e. part of the Commerce Dept - NMFS is responsible for creating and maintaining jobs, along with regulating fisheries), they aren't necessarily just using science to create regulations - they have to also create business.
I respect fishermen for the tough job they do, and the environment they work in...we all know the sea is an unforgiving place. However, regulations were put in place because fishermen are not willing to regulate themselves. They may "catch" themselves out of a job, but when one sea resource has been depleted or destroyed, they will move to the next one to make a living. I don't blame them, but I also don't support the indiscrimate slaughter of species nor destruction of undersea habitat. The article below underscores what years of dragging had done, and then how long it took to bring SOME stocks back to a fishable population.

"""The U.S. government closed several areas of New England's Georges Bank and the Mid-Atlantic to all fishing except lobster traps in an effort to shore up plummeting cod and haddock stocks. For nearly five years, more than 6,500 square miles of Georges Bank's sea floor were undisturbed, helping key fish stocks, including several of the area's haddock and yellowtail flounder stocks, to start rebounding. Other marine species benefited as well. Once-depleted scallop stocks resurged inside the closed areas, leading to a financial bonanza for the fishing industry when some of these areas were reopened for rotational scalloping (New England scallop landings have more than doubled over the last six years). In the areas still closed, scientists have identified increases in crabs, anemones, sea urchins and other invertebrates. However, New England's signature groundfish -- the cod -- continues to struggle, particularly on Georges Bank. Restoration may take decades. Maintaining closures large enough and long enough to be effective and halting fishing when discard limits are reached will be critical in restoring healthy fish populations and the livelihoods of fishermen who depend on them, as well as fully-functioning and diverse marine ecosystems."""

To the guy that remarked about being able to market "accidentally" caught out of season species trapped in gill nets...if folks were allowed to sell those fish as "by-catch", those fish would quickly become the target species. This has been discussed on this board before...
I was involved in fisheries enforcement. While a lot of folks were honest, there will always be those who will do anything to catch the last fish. We caught people dragging in closed fishing areas. Regulations required mesh sizes large enough for juvenile fish to escape, but a lot of the trawlers would put smaller mesh cod ends inside of larger mesh nets so that smaller marketable species like squid could be harvested. Didn't seem to matter they were also killing their future livelyhood on unmarketable juvenile fish. Then there are the Turtle Excluding Device & Bycatch Reduction Device regulations on some trawlers & shrimpers. We caught many folks who wired them shut. Recreationals aren't different. We all have an impact on fisheries. There are those on this board who want to, and do cross the 3 mile line to chase rock - because they're there - and then scatter when "the man" arrives on the scene. Unfortunately, just like speeders, a cop can only catch one at a time...

Finally back to the point...the commercial folks on VMRC will generally vote to keep or create commercial fishing & crabbing jobs, despite the cost to the environment or fish stocks. Okay, I'm off my :soapbox:

Bill

 

[Kevin Smith]

Thanks!

Bill-Gatorman,

There is a lot of great information in your response to this thread.

You are 100% right that we all must take the time to speak up to help protect the Chesapeake Bay and Virginia's Tidal Rivers from overfishing of all types.

Thanks for your thoughtful and informative response.

Kevin Smith
Weekend Mistress

 

[jerryaycock]

I got the same form letter, At least we know who NOT to vote for.....

 

[BYRD]

I have a question. IF this gets passed and two more commercial guys get appointed that will make five commercial members. If the other five are purely rec guys, and assuming they will vote on comm vs rec lines. Every vote will end up tied 5 to 5 right. So the question is who is the tie breaker?


Or is that scenario completely off base.